I’M GOING TO DIZZ KNEE LAND
A CONVERSATION WITH DRUMMER PHIL LEAVITT OF DADA
The alternative rock scene of the ‘90s was an exhilarating time that changed the landscape for rock and whose influence can still be heard today. One band involved in that era of alternative rock was the incredibly talented Dada (often stylized as dada), known most for their hit song “Dizz Knee Land”. Consisting of Michael Gurley, Joie Calio, and Phil Leavitt, dada’s intricate and skilful guitar playing, beautifully melodic vocal harmonies (which set them apart from most alternative rock acts from the ‘90s), impressive drumming, and a sublime combination of genres gave them a wide and loyal fanbase. Recently, I had the opportunity to talk to Leavitt about some of his career memories.
Over 30 years ago, dada broke into the music scene with Puzzle. “It was one of the most exciting times that I have had in my life at that moment. I had made a lot of demos. We’d all done demos and independent kind of homemade records but to be making a label album, in those days, first of all, getting a label deal was kind of the biggest thing you could hope for in music. Getting signed was everything back in those days. It’s a little bit different now, of course; it has a little different meaning than it used to, but in those days, ‘91, ‘92, getting signed was a real big deal. It’s what we were all striving for. So, to actually be there was a huge thrill, let alone being in a professional recording studio with the likes of Ken Scott as your producer, who, of course, cut his teeth as an engineer at Abbey Road for The Beatles and then has a long list of credits behind it, including [David] Bowie and Supertramp. It was incredible to be working with Ken and just learning about how to really make a record. Doing it in a way that I had never done it before, where you’re working on all these songs simultaneously and seeing the way he prepared the band and got the sounds and kept track of everything; a big whiteboard in the studio with all the different tasks that we had. It was a super exciting time for a dream to come to fruition because that’s what we all wanted to do when we were like 10, 11, 12 years old, to be in a recording studio making an album like all of our heroes did and there we were doing it. It couldn’t have been a more exciting time. Also getting a chance to listen to Ken talk about working with The Beatles and Led Zeppelin. This was mind-blowing for us. We were just like little kids sitting on Grandpa’s knee at Christmas, listening to great old stories. You couldn’t believe it because I grew up a massive Beatles fan, and all of us did. We all loved The Beatles and all the other kind of music from the ‘60s and ‘70s and there was the guy who was in the room with our heroes.”
“Dizz Knee Land” was the breakthrough song for dada. It received extensive radio play, helped propel the sales of Puzzle, and helped generate a loyal fanbase for the band. “It made all the difference in the world. To have a single back in those days that registered and got on the radio is what put the band on the map. Without it, I don’t think we would have gone on tour with Sting, and probably, without it, we would not be able to do what we’re doing now. It’s a double-edged sword, though, I guess in that some people thought it was a novelty kind of song, so you have to live with that and get over that. Besides that, and that’s a very small thing, everything else is an upside because that’s why people know who we are. A lot of people think that’s not our strongest song, and digging into our other albums, they like our other material more, but for us, I think we always have a soft spot for that one because that’s what put us on the map.”
Leavitt also has another band called 7Horse, which he formed with fellow dada member Joie Calio. “Meth Lab Zoso Sticker” was featured in Martin Scorsese’s film The Wolf of Wall Street. Leavitt recounts this experience, saying, “As you can imagine, it was quite exciting, especially coming out of a career in dada where we’ve had a pretty good moment in the sun, as you might say and then to start something completely different and have that make a cultural impact is pretty exciting. Martin Scorsese has such a reputation as a director and guy who utilizes music so well in his films and is really into music. It was a real point of pride for us, a real feather in our cap. Again, that song put 7Horse on the map. So, it’s similar in a way to “Dizz Knee Land”, whereas we’ll always have a soft spot for “Meth Lab Zoso Sticker” because it’s been immortalized now in his film. Those things last forever. That’s not going away. So, when I’m 80, I’ll be looking at The Wolf Of Wall Street and go, ‘ah, there’s my song’.”
CHECK OUT PUZZLE ON SPOTIFY
Leavitt cites The Beatles (Ringo Starr), Buddy Rich, and The Police (Stewart Copeland) as the biggest inspirations that got him into drumming. He says, “I started banging around on pots and pans when I was maybe 3, 4, 5 years old. I was one of those kinds of kids. My first exposure to music, maybe was The Monkees on television, reruns of The Monkees. But I have a cousin of mine who’s a few years older than me, and when she got a sense of what I was listening to, she went, ‘no, not these guys’. Although The Monkees are great and have some great songs, she kind of turned me toward The Beatles. There was something about them, about Ringo [Starr] about the dynamic of a band, of friends, and the kind of brotherhood of a band that really appealed to me. The songs really hit me deeply. As far as the drums go, I mean Ringo; I could imitate and play along with The Beatles since I was young, so that drew me in. Like a lot of people there were so many drummers influenced by him. At the same time, I used to see Buddy Rich on the old Johnny Carson show. If I stayed up late, Buddy Rich would be on. I’d see him playing incredible drums, and just the size of his personality; he was a very flamboyant person and showed me, ‘Oh, this guy is a drummer, but he’s kind of a star on his own’. Then, when I was about 13, I started listening to The Police, and Stewart Copeland hit me in a very profound way. Stewart Copeland’s utterly original kind of take on the merger of rock and ska he did really caught my ears, and it was very inspiring. I remember going to school in the morning in the days in America where it was very easy to get on and off campus, and you’d go in for homeroom, take the roll call, I’d say here and immediately walk home and go on my drum set and play along with The Police all afternoon. My Mom was at work. She didn’t know what I was doing. So yeah, The Police, The Beatles and Buddy Rich, those are the three touchpoints for me that were really inspirational and probably are the reason I’m a drummer today.”
The music industry is constantly shifting in both good and bad ways. One difference Leavitt sees in creating music in the ’90s compared to the present day is the way in which musicians need to put as much time and energy into marketing themselves as they do with creating music. He remarks, “In the ’90s, there was no social media, and bands were not responsible for marketing. That was the sales and marketing people’s job at the label. On that level, I miss those days because nobody ever got into the music business to become a ‘content creator.’ We were musicians. We wanted to write and make records; that’s our content. To be put in a position where you have to be a marketing whiz in order to have a music career seems ludicrous to me. That’s not how you find the best music. Musicians are not necessarily naturally adept at that. We had to learn along the way how to do it, and it still doesn’t come naturally, whereas playing the drums and writing songs and performing that does come naturally. And that’s what we aspired to do. I would say that’s the biggest difference, having that team around you, that invested in you, those were great times. Now, let’s not get it twisted. The record business was basically developed as a criminal enterprise to take advantage of musicians because we’d basically do it for free because we love it so much, and they knew that. So, they structured the deals so that, ‘let’s give this guy a Cadillac instead of some royalties’, and musicians are like, ‘hey, great, I’ll take it’. So, it has a downside, and you don’t own anything and all the rest of it. But just as far as the functioning of a music career I don’t want to spend my time marketing. I want to spend my time creating music. It was easier to do it that way those days. You could actually do it.”
This year, dada has been on the “Return To Dizz Knee Land” tour to celebrate the 30th anniversary of their debut album Puzzle, which has received an overwhelmingly positive reception from fans. Leavitt discusses the tour and the differences between a special anniversary tour, a festival, and opening up for a headliner, stating, “We missed the 30th anniversary … so this is our 32nd anniversary but were counting it as our 30th. You want to name your tour something, so I came up with “Return To Dizz Knee Land” as a marketing hook because that’s part of my job now. We’re headlining and playing for our most devoted fans, so the enthusiasm and reception have been unbelievably warm and celebratory. If you’re on a stage on a festival there’s a mixed crowd out there. Some of them are going to be there for you and other people are going to be there for other acts, and that can be fun, though. You’re outdoors, it’s a big show, and there’s a lot of people, and that’s really cool. If you’re a support act and you’re playing in front of a headliner that’s well known and nobody knows you, well then, your mindset is, ‘we’re gonna go out there and win these people over’. It’s a very competitive feeling. It’s like the band against the audience, and you’re gonna turn them and make them like you, and that’s a real challenge for a band, and we’ve been in that position before, too. But this tour (“Return To Dizz Knee Land”) is just like a big warm hug from all the fans because they’re so happy to see the band, and it’s been a while, seven years since we’ve been on tour. We get a huge ovation just for walking out there. When you get that kind of response, it makes it pretty smooth sailing throughout the night.”
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Main Photo Credit: Mark Maryanovich | Background Photo Credit: Dennis Keeley
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